Issue with fitting a new starter solenoid to my VF1000F2 Bol dor

In the Shed
#1

Hello again, I purchased a new solenoid from Welmoto to fit to my VF1000F2 Bol dor thinking it would be a straight forward replacement together with having a model type 30A fused fitted. However, I realised this wasn’t to be as the ‘B’ battery and ‘M’ starter motor terminals on to the new solenoid are the other way around! Nothing is ever easy!
I’m now thinking what to do; 1; turn the new solenoid around so the B and M terminals are on the right side for both the battery and starter motor leads, but would then cause an issue connecting the 4-wires block and accessing the fuse, and also not being able to just push the rubber support block into the existing bracket, or 2: having to re-route the battery and starter motor cables across /around the solenoid which isn’t easy with the existing cables.

I hope the above makes sense and any thoughts, help or advise would be appreciated as always.

#2

Fit it upside down… :roll_eyes:

#3

Interesting thought but not a very good option as the frame on the ‘M’ side would be touching or be very close to the connection and the four block connection would need to extended. Anyway, on further thought will look to turn the new solenoid around so the B and M terminals are on the right side for both the battery and starter motor leads, and will modify the standard solenoid bracket.

#4

Does it matter? If the connectors from the battery to the solenoid and the solenoid to the motor are reversed, the current will still flow from the battery to the motor.

What’s important is the connection to the solenoid from the starter switch. If that’s reversed the solenoid won’t work - it’ll try to move away from the contacts not towards them.

Or am I misunderstanding the situation?

#5

You can’t reverse the connections of the main supply from the battery and main lead to starter motor because the main 30amp fuse (and of course the positive lead to the ignition switch) is also connected to the battery side connection on the solenoid. This would mean that you would only get power to the rest of the bike when the solenoid is on, which it would never be. If this is a cheap Chinese copy of the original solenoid then it could be possible that they have labelled the connections incorrectly. It could be checked by a continuity test from the battery side of the main fuse to the connection labelled battery and the connection labelled S/Motor. Whichever has continuity then that is the battery connection.

#6

Is that the case, though? The supply to the starter will only be provided when the solenoid is activated; said supply won’t care which power terminal on the unit it’s connected to.

The solenoid is only a switch. As long as the fused supply is taken from the battery side, it won’t care which physical side of the solenoid it’s connected to. The critical connections are the two that ‘pull in’ the solenoid. If they’re reversed it won’t work.

Doing a continuity check will identify the pull in coil connectors. The main power connections should be open circuit unless the solenoid is activated.

If the battery lead is on the left hand terminal, the starter on the right hand terminal it will work. If those connections are reversed, it will still work. It’s the pull in coil connectors that are critical.

1 Like
#7

Hi Chris, Thanks for responding back. I thought in order to connect the solenoid to the bike correctly, the B connection had to be connected to the + battery lead and the M connection to lend for the starter motor. It was just that the solenoid I bought from Welmoto has the connectors the other way around and makes fitting difficult. A genuine part from David Silver Spares is £89 and hence the reason I bought an after market part ( All the after market parts look the same with the B and M connectors the other way around where the main 30A fuse and 4-pin connector block are at the front of the solenoid) To be honest, I have a spare Honda item from my other parts bike and may just fit this for easy at the moment.

#8

My experience from sourcing parts when mine was being restored was very similar. I found that after market parts were often cheap copies that didn’t quite fit, or required some level of modification to install otherwise.

Sometimes you just have to wince, grit your teeth and buy an OEM spare.

#9

Yes Chris you are misunderstanding the situation. There is an internal connection inside the whole switch/solenoid/fuse assembly. This internal connection is only attached to one of the starter solenoids main connections (High Amperage) which should be the connection going direct to the battery. This connection carries the main red wire to the ignition switch so that when the ignition switch is turned on it provides power to the rest of the motorcycle, including the starter switch, which when pressed supplies power to the solenoid switch which connects the two high amperage terminals together supplying the battery power direct to the starter motor over very thick cables because as you should know the starter system carries high amps as well. If the main battery lead is connected to the dormant terminal, the one leading to the starter motor, the internal connection to the ignition switch will not be connected to the battery and therefore the solenoid switch and the rest of the motorcycle will not work. This is why I said that a continuity test would tell you whether they have labelled the terminals wrong or not. Your statement about a solenoid being only a switch is correct but the whole solenoid/main fuse/connection assembly is more than a switch, it also supplies the ignition switch with power direct from the battery with a main fuse between them. If there is no power to the ignition switch the motorcycle will not work without power if there is no power how can the solenoid work and connect the battery to the ignition switch. If what you are saying was correct then when the starter button was released and the solenoid disengages then power would be disconnected to the ignition switch, but the solenoid would not work anyway because there would be no power at the ignition to start off with. I have tried to explain this as simply as possible, As a motorcycle electrician/mechanic I know that things can get difficult to understand sometimes.
John

#10

Hi, John,

That makes sense. I wasn’t aware of the internal connection.

On every solenoid I’ve played with (I’ve never had need to have dealings with a Honda one as fitted to the VFs) the permanent live connections just go onto the same external battery connection as the main power lead, held onto the stud connector with a nut.

The S**u*i I’m rebuilding is arranged like that. There is one red wire from that stud that goes into the fuse box, then from the fuse box to the ignition switch, then from there back to the fuse box.

Why did Honda complicate it like that? Is there any benefit?

You live and learn.

C.

#11

Sounds like you need a new harness mate.
Stay safe.
John

#12

I have used Solenoids with the opposite “B” & “M” configuration from stock and just swapped the Female blade connector locations on the top plug from the main harness to compensate.